OM Ep. 179 - From Acquisition to Acceleration: Marketing Strategies for Growing Dental Practices

Brad Hughes

Everybody. This is doctor Brad Hughes, CEO and founder of Vision Dental Partners. In this podcast, we're going to hit some amazing topics from acquisition to practice acceleration and growth and some strategies around that, and my favorite topic, which is create and grow your brand.

Dean Steinman

Well, hello everybody out there in podcast land. This is Dean Steinman from worth On Marketing and guess what, we are back with another awesome podcast for you. Now, I'm very psych today. It's end of May twenty twenty five, and someone's right around the corner.

As a Nick fan. Tonight it's a big, big game for us, So if any Nick fans are out there, and when you hear this, hopefully after the fact, we already won and we're in the in the finals. But tonight we're playing Game five of the Celtics. So fingers crossed there anyway with getting right to it.

So I have a really spoke for my guest today, So I have with me today doctor Brad Hughes. And Brad is the CEO and founder of really great organization, Visual Dental partners, and we're here to talk a little bit about the future of practices and acquisition and what's your end game and what you need to look at and to be educated. I'm sure you get emails all the time, you know, guys out there, so it's how to sift through it and what to look for. So Brad, welcome, man How are you today?

Brad Hughes

Hey, excited to be here, Dean, that like that intro and that introduction, Like, now I'm even more fired up. So that was all there?

Dean Steinman

You go awesome, Yeah, we'd like to light that fire, bro. Thanks. So Brad, tell us a little bit about who is doctor Brad Hughes.

Brad Hughes

Yeah, been practicing and practicing Dennis for eighteen years. Graduated from Indiana University in two thousand and seven, which from the dental school, which doesn't seem like it should have been that long ago, but now it's already been. Gosh, yeah, just unbelievable. So time is flying.

So I've been practicing for eighteen years. Started out in right outside of Fort in Indiana. I was a huge dental group in Leo, Indiana, practice with my dad for a couple of years there, just kind of had a big entrepreneurial spirit. So we've from twenty nineteen on, we've acquired eight more practices and we're now a nine practice group based out of South Carolina in Indiana.

And just living that. We're in the thick of it, we're in the arena, we're figuring it out and. It's fun.

Dean Steinman

So I always asked us to our guest because so many doctors come on board and they decided to, yeah, I'm going to try the you know, entrepreneurial hat on instead of running a practice.

So was your aha moment. To say, yeah, I'm gonna do a little bit of switcheroo here and take on this this undertaking.

Brad Hughes

Yeah, you know, I I think it was pretty darn early on. Like, I'm obsessed with the operation side, the marketing side.

I like clinical dentistry. I love the operational, the community involvement, the the marketing pieces. Just kind of the game around how do we actually grow a business, how do we get how do we create a vision that that team members align with. How do we build a practice that that we can build local legends for our doctors in their community.

I've been obsessed with that, literally probably since my second or third week in practice. You know, I was. I was in our practice there with my dad, and you know, very early on, it's like, hey, I think we can like I think we can quickly double the size of this practice, and and he's like, okay, well I got one foot basically half out the door, so go do what you want to do. And so we just started kind of taking that piece.

But it was really probably twenty twelve, twenty eleven, twenty twelve, where twenty thirteen where it was like, you know, I'm not moving at the pace I would like to what's the problem here? And I had to look myself in the mirror and probably have about four other people tell me the problem was me. And so we kind of took a bit of a mindset journey and needed to get a little bit more in an abundance mindset. I needed to figure some things out and made a promise to myself, Hey, I will go acquire a second practice after I triple my first practice. And we were doing five by most people's account, you know, we were doing it was a good practice, it was very profitable.

I probably would have been easier just to have said, let's just keep moving with this thing. But we went out tripled it and probably around twenty sixteen twenty seventeen, and then in twenty nineteen opportunity came along and so we acquired another practice and we could have kind of gone from there.

Dean Steinman

So as a dentisty people, you probably have two hats on one. Obviously, pretend you don't even have your company.

Now you're you, and you're ever your dentist hat, and you're not looking at a Vision dental. You're at Doctor Hughes Denteal. You probably get. Two, three, four or five six emails a day from potential people who want to acquire you, merge, et cetera.

So hey, what goes through your mind? Is a dentist oh another one of these or you know are people or you're looking at an ex strategy from day one, you know, because I get these emails all the time as well. You know, we're looking for it, you know, but you're looking to sell you your agency, want to sell your agency? And no, no, no, no no no. But in a while something does go through it talk and obviously I'm not ready to sell it yet. But you know, why does somebody Why would you think somebody would even think about going the route of a partner like you.

Brad Hughes

Well, I think there's there's you know, let's go back, like, I'll take that one step further, and I'll say I think it's the same reasons that when we do acquisitions, I'm looking for good core value fits. Like we did an acquisition with a great doctor, Randy Stauffer up in Elkhart, Indiana. We closed on that practice March first, and he's just such a good dude. And he came to me and he's like, I've you know, he's fifty five, fifty six years old.

He's like, I've done the same numbers for the last five years. I'm tired of just being complacent in that number. I need help to get to the next level. And I think you're the dude to help get me there.

And as we sat around and talked for about two hours, when we got done, he had tears in his eyes and he's like, I'm ready for that. I'm ready for this. And I think, to answer your question, it would be because I want to feel that same way when somebody comes to me when I run out of run way and and and I can't go to a bank anymore and continue on our our our path, and we want to bring on a strategic partner, I want to sit down and have that conversation and feel that exact same way because they hit every key point and we align. We align from a core value standpoint, we align from a future growth standpoint, because that ultimately is how business deals work.

I've done I've done one deal that did not work out very well, and it's because I should have seen the red flags during during some of the due diligence. I probably just skipped over them because I wanted to do the deal. But core value alignment is everything. And so when somebody comes to us and says, look, I love the personal brand that you're building, doctor Hughes, I love the brand that you guys have at Vision Dental Partners.

I love the transparency. I love the fact that you guys talk about the things that you've screwed up. I love the fact that you talk about the things that you've done really well. That's who we're looking for in a strategic is that we want to invest in you guys and help you take that next two to three X jump.

And I want to leave that meeting going I'm fired up, let's go do it. And I think that's what separates us because at the end of the day, like I kind of laugh, because there's so many groups or practices out there who are like, you know, we're disrupting the space and we're doing things different than everybody else. Bullshit, you're not. We're all doing the same frickin thing.

The only thing that separates us from everybody else is brand, and everybody's got their own brand. And I just want you know, when somebody comes to us to acquire us, it's not like, hey, are you looking to exit make some money. I'm not. I will eventually be looking for a strategic partner who likes our brand and who aligns with that, and that'll be the most important thing.

And it's the same thing that we look for in acquisitions ourselves.

Dean Steinman

Love that. When I first get on with the practice and they come to me to help them with the marketing, the first thing I asked them is what makes you different? What's your differentiator? And nine percent of the practice have no clue what that means, you. Know, And they're like, oh, we give great service, We're a family business, you know, you know we have the best technology.

Well my response to that is you're better, You're better, and you're better. That's not a differentiator, that's a necessity. You know, you know. So from your perspective, what would you say is a disruptor a differentiator for a dental practice.

You know, when his branding, it's not just a logo, it's positioning, it's your message, it's where you fit in the community, because you're part of a community. So what would you say are the two most important factors in making a practice stand out.

Brad Hughes

I'll give you a great example. So my dad started my original practice.

I was in Hughes Dental Group in Leo, Indiana in nineteen eighty. So he graduated from Indiana University down School nineteen eighty started, he graduated in May, started that practice and August of nineteen eighty has not seen a patient since two thousand and nine in that office, and we have eight locations in Indiana. I'm the lone soldier down here in South Carolina. So I still travel eight hundred miles up there.

I do a lot of associate coaching. I still go up and run meetings, do all of the things up there, and I can go into that practice and there's still a lot of patients that have been coming in since nineteen eighty six, and they will still to this day. Here we are, what sixteen years later, and they say, what's going on with your dad? How's your dad? Is your dad still playing a lot of golf? Is your dad still into fishing? That man is an incredible local legend in that community. And it's not because he was a dentist.

It was because he had positioned himself as a likable human being and he just built a massive brand in that community. And that's the differentiator. Had nothing to do with a Google ad, It had nothing to do with direct mail, piece, had nothing to do with any type of marketing. Was just that he Yes, he over delivered to the patients that came in for a long time, but they just liked who he was authentically.

And that doesn't mean that everybody liked him, but the people who had commonality and similarity with him and still come in that office thirty years later, that's how you That is how you differentiate yourself. Not everybody's gonna like me that comes in my office, but the ones that do and I can build brand with, and they trust me before they ever come in because they've seen social media posts that I put out or whatever and these are patients that stay pay and refer to me at a very high level. They come in because of my brand, not because of my Crown Preps or my Root Canal or any other reason. They just come in because they aligned with me.

Otherwise they would go to any number of I mean there's thirty dentists in Bluffed in South Carolina. They could go to.

Dean Steinman

Love that. It was like a marketing all day long with you.

Yeah, Look, marketing is a differentiator. Guys, planning simple. You know, if you do not market yourself, you will not succeed in twenty twenty five and plus you will not plan it simple. If you don't invest money in your practice from marketing advertising this perspective, you will fail plent one hundred percent.

Brad Hughes

And I think you hit the nail on the head earlier. So many think that that's they market technology and they need to market themselves right. Themselves are the thing that people want to come see. If you think a CBCT is going to drive people to your practice, like, get the hell over it? That ain't it that? Like they don't know they think everybody has that.

And you know, I've bet a CBCT in my practice for ten years it's not I've never had one patient. I'm here because you have a CBCT. No, they're here because, hey, my neighbors come to you and they really like you, and I'm like, awesome.

Dean Steinman

That's the key. And from one step further when it is position, taking your brand and position out there. You could crow to the cows come home how great you are. But if your patients are the ones who do it, that's where the differentiator is is they need to tell everybody how great you are and spread the word to all their friends on social media. Somebody comes into your office and you.

Were a game changer and you made their teeth whiter and they hated their teeth before, or straight or what have you. They want to tell you're in a smile business. You want to basically share the well, share the happiness and let them share it and tell everybody how great it is. But the biggest poll that I see is their doctors don't know how to ask and they're afraid.

And you have to have that in place.

What one bit of advice would you give to a practice to help them scale successfully their marketing if they could do today? What's one thing somebody could do today?

Brad Hughes

I would take a multi prong approach.

I mean, there's a time and a place for Google ads like I think you know, don't just waste money, like track the data, know what you're getting, know what you're not getting. If something's working, throw a little bit more money at it, continue it to work. You're going to get you know, there's going to be some patients. Like it's just it's an attention game, right, So how many eyeballs can you get on? You're going to get a certain amount on from Google.

The second piece of that is I would say that there are a lot who are not comfortable in front of a camera. Get damn comfortable in front of a camera and start posting on different platforms because people and their attention. Is right here. And if you're on Facebook, Instagram at a certain level, if you want to be on TikTok like it's it's like there's you just got to get.

You've got to create some good content. People need to know who you are as a dentist, just really not even as a dentist. They just need to know who you are as a human being. They want to know whether you like I post content all the time about how I like F one racing.

I'm a private pilot. I don't eat a lot of bread. I've got twin daughters that are into X Y Z and they come in and that's what they're talking about. It has nothing to do with dentistry.

They're like, oh my god, I was you know, like, if you like F one racing, you probably like this is you know, you're from Indiana. Do you like IndyCar racing? Because it's Indy five hundred month in Indiana? Like, do you like that? That's the stuff they come in talking to me about, not dental stuff. And that's how you build relationships and you move people to yes. At the end of the day, we're just trying to positively influence patients to say yes to things that they need.

That's the game. So just you know, even if. You suck at it, Like there are plenty of days I create content, I'm not that good and those other days I'm pretty good at it and I've been doing it for a little while. So like just start and you know, you've got to focus on building brand.

Brand is dentistry is becoming so commoditized in the ortho space and the general dental space and the oral surgery space. In every space, it's becoming about price, and we need to make it about brand. And that is a that is a massive game changer.

Dean Steinman

Perfect segue to the next thing.

So price, you know, ideally price should never be an issue. If you get somebody in your chairs for a new patient perspective, you have really no excuse for letting them leave. Okay, So what's one bit of vice that you could come to somebody when it comes to price, because you might be a little bit higher then than somebody down the block. So how would you.

Get somebody who And it takes a very unique person to be able to overcome certain objections and do sales. So somebody sits in your chair and they're looking to do in plans for the ears, Lemons, whatever it is, and well you're at two thousand. Dollars more than than the guy down the block. For you, how do you respond?

Brad Hughes

Well, yeah, everybody has objections.

I mean you and I if we go anywhere, right, Like, I'm probably the worst. You know. I don't go to a lot of medical appointments, but like I know, when I've gone to the chiropractor, they're always like, well, we want to take some extras. I'm like, eh, don't worry about it, Like, just do what you need to do.

Let's let's just get moving here. Like I ain't got a lot of time. It's like I'm one of those bat Like if they would just if one of these chiropractors would just explain to me the reason, like let's just take the damn X ray one time, Hughes, this is why you need it. But it's always just like so my objection usually is time.

If they're like, look, it's going to take thirty seconds, do it, I'd be like fine. So, like the objections, whether it's budget. Time, maybe they're fearful, trust can be an objection that you have to overcome. So but first you got to go back to you got to understand what the patient values.

Number one, do they value function? Do they value longevity? Do they value comfort? Do they value cosmetic? It's usually one of those four things. So you've got to get on their level. And I see. Dentists in orthodonis all the time where it's like you're putting your own bias around what you think the patient should value.

Like I was coaching on Wednesday of this week with one of our really good doctors in Indiana, and you know, he kept talking to the patient like I would I really think you need to Like I really think you need to do this because I don't want to. See you lose that tooth if it cracks in half. And I'm like, I kept telling them, like, but it's not about you don't want to see them. You got to make it so that do you value longevity or function? Because if you lose that tooth, it's a first molar seventy six percent of your chewing efficiency.

What is that going to do to function? And you know, like most people don't want to lose what they have. So if it's not function, maybe it's longevity. Maybe they just want to do the thing that's going to help keep them keep that tooth in their head the longest. So like, you've got to be able to meet them where they're at and understand that it's not about what you think, doctor so and so or what you value, it's what the patient value.

So number one, you got to dive in and really understand what they value. Number two, then you got to be over able to overcome the objection and and you know, our teams can do that. You know, in the general dental space, hygienis can do that, front desk team members can can work on those things. And sometimes as dentists we have to be able to overcome them.

But the main selling point is you got to understand if your two thousand dollars more expensive, You got to tell them how much value you're going to create, and then you got to you gotta know what they value. The most, right and. Then you know from there that that's pretty that's wildly influential. And at that point, yeah, they become less concerned about the money because now they know you're you're the one to.

Dean Steinman

Do it the results, experience and what they get out of it, what's in it for them? I always tell people my favorite radio station is w i I FM. What's in it for me? And so we can do marketing. It's not about you, doc, it's about them. So anything you push out it's about the patient, not about you.

Got two more questions for you, Brad. So you know somebody is you know, we spoke about a guy that you came with the other day. You got one of the you know, perfect match for you, blah blah blah. So somebody is in their fifties now the sixties, and they're kind of just at the point now where they think of doing the next exit or what have you.

What are three questions that should ask a potential partner like you to see if it's a right fit from both sides. So I'm putting you went back in the dentist chair, so you're getting contacted by you know, by Vision Dental or by this practical with this or this one or this group one are three questions that they should be prepared to ask you because it's an interview both ways. So what are three things that they should know about their next potential partner or ask them in order to feel comfortable.

Brad Hughes

I think number one that they should always be asking me is how how much can we grow in the first twenty four months? You know, if you really want to impress me, say twelve, Like that's because most practices that we've come across that, I mean, that's always something I'm looking for, is like, is there is there upside in the first twelve months? But if they're thinking twelve to twenty four months of growth, and you know, if I've I've probably seen the data, if we're if we're having a conversation at that level, I don't I don't go in any acquisition less I really feel like we can grow at least twenty five percent in year one and so if if they if they kind of give you the oh that that seems like a lot, you know, Okay, great, Like let's dive into why.

I mean, we're just gonna we're gonna pull that lever, that lever, that lever, and it's actually really easy. If that gets them excited, great, But I think it should be because you can't just stay status quo, like that's not the objective. If you want to stay status quo, like, you really shouldn't be selling your prowd. I don't like, you've probably waited too.

Long at that point. If you just want to stay status quo, like you should have sold earlier when you were still in a growth mindset, you're just not going to get the same value in my opinion. But to me, that would be Number one is like, let's let's get excited about what we can do together. Number two it's how do we grow new patients? Because I don't care if you're seeing twenty two new patients or you know, we have a practice in Bloomington in Indiana that averages over one hundred and twelve new patients a month.

We should be able to grow both. If you're at one hundred and twelve, let's add fifteen more month. If you're at twenty two, let's go double it. And number three.

I think the next the third question should be how far are you looking to go before we bring on a strategic partner, because I think it's I think that's a really important question because exit strategy. I don't care if you're a twenty eight year old dentist or a fifty eight year old dentist. It should be on your mind. Where how do we maximize ourselves financially? Because everybody wants to sit around and talk about ebit of this and ebit of that.

Like I'm much more concerned about cash flow than I am. Ebita. It's become a fun sexy term that dentists love to talk about, but it's but everybody needs to be concerned about what's the exit strategy. If you're twenty eight years old, it's you know that may morph.

Like my exit strategy now is way different than it was at twenty eight, but I've always been thinking about it, and I'm sure it'll be different five years from now. But but we have a very set plan in place to when and how and who we'll be looking for when that comes about So I think they should be asking that question, what what is the strategy to bring on a big strategic partner to help us go from where we are and keep this thing moving in the right direction. Because that's the point of joining a group, right, is that there should be financial gain. And that's one of the benefits of joining a group like us is that we got a lot of runway, Like there's a lot of upside and and I know that has really been an exciting thing for our partner doctors, is let's let's let's go reach and sustain that upside.

So I think those are three pretty good questions.

Dean Steinman

Cool, all right, So now it's going to time, you know, shameless plug. So let's talk a little bit about vision Danel and what you do. And you know, somebody's listening and they're looking for a potential next partner.

It was you, guys, bro.

Brad Hughes

Yeah, I mean, I you know, we're we're we're a little bit of a DSO slash group slash DPO like we were a bit of a hybrid group where I'm looking, you know, if you want a partner and still retain forty percent equity in your group and your practice, great I'm super open to that. If you want to sell one hundred percent of the assets, but you want to work five to ten more years, open to that too, and anything in between. I I'm not completely like we've been successful in both of those models.

We also want younger doctors to work for us for a short amount of time and then and then buy in at the practice level. One of our rock star dentists in Indiana, doctor Blake Wile at New Haven Dental Center, just bought bought into his practice. We've got a few others that are doing the same. I want partners in this game.

And so even if I'm acquiring a practice at one hundred percent, We'll go find another doctor who can come in. You know, we'll keep that doctor on, but go find another younger doctor that we can coach up and train up and become a partner. So, you know, I'm the founder, but I'm still working four days a week, so I'm in the arena. I understand the challenges.

We've got a phenomenal management team. We've got we've got a fully baked out HR department to help with the issues in recruiting right now that we've done very well with. We've got a great operations team. Our marketing department with Lex is phenomenal.

But we're also we do a lot. I also have a ten person production team. We have eight full time video editors. We have two content directors.

I am big on organic social and building brand and so if you want to be a local legend in your community, I've talked about my dad. I've done the same thing with myself. That's the objective for our doctors is to become that damn local legend that just dominates their community. And the way that we do that is by getting attention on us, and that's through social And you know, these aren't platforms for sixteen year olds anymore.

TikTok is not for dancing. Like, this is real world stuff and it works, and and that's our group. You know, we've done well. We'd like to add another probably three to four practices over the next twelve months.

I think we're fully equipped for that from a management team standpoint, and you know, I think overall we do a pretty damn good job.

Dean Steinman

Awesome, all right, Two final questions. One, so I'm giving you two gifts. First gift is you get to go back in time fifteen years ago what's one thing you had telling Brad looking in the mirror and you're saying, what advice are you giving yourself?

Brad Hughes

Yeah, fifteen years ago, so I would have been turning thirty.

I'll be forty five here in just a couple of weeks. You know. I think the first thing would be would be a big one that I coach and preach a lot is get over the ego of doctor title, right, patients, You're not moving pay to yes and being influential because you have a title or because I have letters behind my name. You're doing it because of who you are, in the words that you say, in your body language.

And I think when you go into when you talk about case acceptance and you think they're doing things because you're a doctor, I think it's more manipulative than it is than it is influential. And you know, so from a team standpoint, I think I would have been a better leader fifteen years ago had I dropped some of that ego, and I think I would have been I think I would have grown my first practice faster had I figured out that I was the frickin' problem. And so I think that's where I would start.

Dean Steinman

Cool, all right, Then, Now I have my second gift for you.

I'm giving you the ability to have dinner with anybody in history. Who you meet, who you who are you hanging with?

Brad Hughes

Uh? This you know, this will be. If I could have dinner with anybody in history, such a good question. I would go back.

I would have dinner with. A forty year old Bobby Knight. Okay, you know Bobby Knight growing up in Indiana, you know, in the eighties, and I mean the guy was our god Indiana. Basketball was our religion every kid in Indiana.

Like you know, if people think you don't grow up in Indiana or at least then dreaming of playing basketball for Indian University and Bobby Knight and all the things that we did, and at least I certainly did, and it was it was a religion in our in our community and in our family. And I would love to have a conversation with Bobby Knight in his prime, just because the no nonsense, no bullshit. The general level of execution. I mean, find me someone who was better at it, I you know, and just about life, just anything.

I think it would be an unbelievable conversation that'd be a lot of fun.

Dean Steinman

What's what's the first thing you're going to ask him then?

Brad Hughes

Um, you're the level of execution. How do you continuously, every single day, consistently demand the level. Of execution that you do, Because I think that's hard.

I think it's the hell out of everybody. That's why it scares

Dean Steinman

the hell out of them.

Brad Hughes

Well, I think that there was an element of you know, he was kind of an intimidating guy. He was, but.

I think you know, you look at those teams in the seventies, early eighties, late eighties and eighty seven with Alford and Keith Smart, you know, the early nineties with Colbert Cheney and Greg Graham and al Hereson, Like those guys were. They were just so good. They were so. Competitive and they and they just pumped out so many kids that you know, they went to class, they did things the right way.

He just demanded a level. Of execution that and they loved him for it. You know, he just could marry the two so well, and uh, it just pretty phenomenal stuff.

Dean Steinman

Still that he's the last coach to go undefeated in the season and it's almost fifty years and nobody has done it since, So that's one incredible milestone.

There for sure. I think about it. Many you know, teams have been played college basketball in the lest fifty years and nobody has. Gone undefeated since then.

So cool, right, all right, Brad, you somebody wants to learn more about you, talk to you, say what's up? Just learn more information. What's the best way for somebody to learn more about you? Catch up?

Brad Hughes

Yeah? Really? Two ways? Find me on LinkedIn, Brad Hughes pretty easy, send me a message, connect with me email It's B. D. Hughes dds at gmail dot com.

Either way is pretty easy to reach me. I'm pretty damn responsive, So reach out.

Dean Steinman

Cool hey Brad, Well, thanks so much for joining. I appreciate it.

This is awesome time. I really appreciate it. Real insightful. And guys, think about it.

If you're at the point of your career that you're just like, what am I going to do next? And you get complacent or you just wanted to see us in the future, reach out to Brad, you know, follow him. He's real smart. Guys, got great content out there and it might be something that listen to both adventure nothing gain, so give give it a shot. Everybody, podcast Land, thanks so much for listening.

Be happy be Smile. Smile, and once once again let's go next.