OM Ep. 168 - Patient Reactivations of Using Retainers with Blair Feldman Way

Blair Feldman

Hey, I'm doctor Blair Feldman. I'm an orthodonist and the president and co founder of Retainer Club. In today's podcast, Dean and I discuss how to differentiate your practice, specifically using retainer programs all the benefits that go from just making it easier for your patients to replace retainers to extending the lifetime value of services in your practice. Really focused on growth.

You won't want to miss it. This is an amazing podcast and I'm excited to share this information with you.

Dean Steinman

Well, hello everybody out there and podcast land, It's Dean Steinmann from Worth of Marketing and guess what we are back but for another podcast for so I hope everybody is having a great fall.

It's now middle of October twenty twenty four, and if you follow me on social media's in my other podcast you'll know that as a Jet fan, it's been kind of a tough year so far, but you know, the Mets are still playing, so I'm happy. And you know, I'm in the smile business. If you could be happy and smile, it's a good thing. So I am very super super stoked to have back one of my favorite people in the industry, are one of my favorite guests and just an overall great guy.

I have doctor Blair Feldman, who is the founder of Retainer Club, and we're here to talk a little bit about how to differentiate yourself in the market and some really cool strategies to help you re engage with people and get more patients coming in the door. So, Blair, good morning, how are you today?

Blair Feldman

I am great, Thank you, and it's really fun to be back. I love speaking with you, and I love engaging with your members and your audience and excited about today's topic.

Dean Steinman

Yeah, thanks, so of my So you know, let's just kind of you jump right into it.

So you know, when I bring on a new practice, even speak to somebody that's reaching out to us, the first thing I always ask them is what's your differentiated? What makes you different in the market, Because, as anybody who's listening to this knows, competition is more fiercer than ever. You know, antist, you now know that people who were referrs and competitors. If you're a dentist and now you're jumping into the orthodontic or liner business and marketing. You need to stand out.

And you're fright that you're competing with everybody else in the market. You're competing directly with director consumers from the big players there. So you need to stand out. And when I talk to a practice, I say what makes you stand out? And I hear, oh, we'll give great service.

We're a family business practice. You know, we want to make sure that you're taking care of you know, we have the greatest technologies. That's not a differentiator everybody. If you're not offering the best service, close your doors.

Okay, if you don't offering the best technologies and up to date technologies, close your doors. You have to have that, all right, But take one step back and think what makes you different? What are you offering to somebody that nobody else is, what somebody else is you know, offering in the market, or you know, what makes you stand out? So, plair, let's talk a little bit about from your perspective, what makes a practice stand out, especially in the retainer world.

Blair Feldman

Yeah, So, I mean, I love this, this sort of this quick line of question, and I hope the listeners really think about it and think like one level deeper than that. Typical answer that they most often give to you when you say that.

So when you say, like what differentiates you and they say, you know, high quality, of course, you know, technology, service, family, I mean those are all great, but I think underneath that is really thinking about these patients and recognizing that they are consumers with choices, and the things that motivate patients these days are are you know, they're time their money, where they're putting it, what kind of experience they have is it's more more important than ever and so you know, like like any other business, we have to look at what we're doing and re evaluate it frequently over time, you know, whether it's every year, every couple of years, and you know, how does our website look, how's our marketing? How are we talking to our patients? So, you know, we began retainer club. We started it in my practice seven years ago and the topic wasn't that common to talk about long term retainer replacement. How we service patients with their desire to replace their retainers so they can maintain their orthodonic results. And you know, now here we are seven years later, there's many businesses that are kind of suggesting different ways to do this there's aligner companies that are offering ways to do this, and really patients want this.

They want to know that when they get their orthodonic treatment. You know, we always joke the dirty secret orthodonics is that if you don't wear your retainers, your teeth a move. And so this idea that you know, you can maintain those results through regular retainer replacement. And it's not just I mean, the biggest reason is life happens, right, you know, you're gonna lose your retainer, You're gonna break your retainer.

So so thinking about all that, thinking about retainer replacement, this idea has really differentiated practices in how you offer that service. So I mean, I'm happy to jump into that, but I mean I'd love to hear from you and the practices you work with. How do they how do they different How do they talk about, you know, the end of treatment and you know they positioned it as the beginning of a retainer relationship or do they talk about it is the end? Let's go find another new patient, you know, see you later, your good luck call us.

Dean Steinman

Exactly, that's right, it right there.

You know, well, you know I think before but a couple of years ago when I was at the businel lines stummit. Oh Hogan gets up and he says, really the only industry that celebrates the end of relationship with the customer. Why what else is there? Nine percent of practices don't get it? Practice patients done, we did that, we did all work. Let's get the next one in.

And that's wrong. You know you have it, but you have somebody there. What else can you offer that? What else can you do that will keep them? You know, part of your practice, help you make money and potentially re engage with them. You know, as you said, that dirty little secret.

You know, if you don't weigh your retainers, what's gonna happen? You know, ninety percent of the time, you know, we're somebody who just spent five, six, seven thousand bucks in a few years. Guess what, they don't have to spend it again, right, or or just a smaller amount, but several thousands. So most practices don't get it, whether they just not or they're just so focused on, you know, get it, you know, bringing the new patients in or focusing on their existings that they don't see so fares through the trees and by offering a program like this is really powerful, you know, and will make a practice stand out. But you know you have to have the right message and the right way to do so you keep just by having it doesn't mean anything.

You got to know what to do with it. And luckily, as for a company here like mine comes in as we with the marketing is we work with practices and we show you how to stand out differently and how to position you and how to run your ads and how to get you know, get you more, you know, patients coming back in, you know, using retainers and to use something different there, you know. So I'd love to hear from you some ideas of what you've seen, because you know, most this is from you know you and have you know, know each other for a few years now, and you know, people oh I do it, I'm good, I'm using a Visil line, or I make it my own andah blah blah blah. So you know, even though you're doing it your own, you think they don't.

Again, the farest through the trees. You know, if you're making it yourself, well you have AI that just makes it automatically and puts the you know, and buys the equipment and then put puts it in and or is a person doing it? You know, persones it. The person costs money? Yeah, for sure. I also quest an average person fifty bucks an hour or so.

And you know, is it worth your time to spend somebody's time to have them just do that? You know, when you pay their pay their insurance and pay you your overhead and blah blah blah. You know it's corossing fifty sixty seventy dollars an hour for that person. So is that the smartest way to use your your team? And how do you stand out different? You know? So you know most practices. You know, before a retainer club came in, what was your retainer program for patients? So once they finished, would you give them one retainers and say okay, good luck let me.

Blair Feldman

Yeah, it was basically, I mean the sort of the script and if you can call it that, it really wasn't much at that time. Was basically, you know, we've given you a great set of retainers and great results. Call us when you need us, like, you know, if your retainer breaks, call us. And it's such a terrible way to service patients.

And it really doesn't address that that under lying fundamental that teeth a move if you lose your retainer. And I think the bigger problem is who do the patients blame when their teeth moved because they lost their retainer. They called your office and they found out it was five hundred bucks to replace the retainers, and they're like, you know what, I'm either not going to do it today or I'll put it on my list of other things I got to do. It gets in line with all the other things that cost, you know, hundreds of dollars.

And they end up not doing it. Their teeth move, and who do they blame. They blame the doctor, they blame the office, and then they want free treatment. I used to call it a court case, like I'd go into the TC room, which she would tell me, oh, you know, our patient deans, you know, not happy.

He said, you know, the teeth moved and it's our fault and he wants us to fix it for free, and you know, it's it's a funny and everyone, you know, I feel like that's been an orthodox for any amount of time. Can can sort of relate to that story. And I look at that problem as a problem that started to that started way back before their teeth moved, and it's that we didn't talk about retention and the importance of it early on. You know, we didn't talk about how we make it easier in our practice to replace retainers.

We didn't talk about the fact that, you know, if you get dental work done, you get a crown, you get you know, something done, You're going to need a new scam to do that. So, I mean, I think you know what it comes down to with these retainer programs is this this sometimes this discrepancy between the plan you've created and the and what your patients want and even what your team wants. And my favorite question. When I go to these conventions and and offices come up as I say, tell me, do.

You have a plan? And now more than ever, practices say yes, we have a program. He said, great, tell me about it. And so I had a funny story. I think it was at the Orthophi convention and a doctor came up to me and she told me about her plans, like I love it.

It's it's a membership fee. It costs six hundred dollars for the patient, and the patient gets access to discounted retainers. And I said, okay, great, sounds like you're happy, and you know, she said, you know, we are, but maybe I'll call you later and she left, and then, you know, a few more groups came by, and a group of staff came by, and they started telling me about their program and I said, that sounds like something I heard earlier. Are you with you know, doctor so and so? And they said yep.

And I said, do you like this program? And they go, no, we hate it. I said, oh, why do you hate it? And they said, well, first of all, we told patients that if they bring in their models, it's one price, and they don't have their models, that's another price. So every morning we get a lunch bag with a couple of models. Usually they're broken, and we can't even use them with a twenty dollars bill like paper clip to this bag.

And we're supposed to make, you know, a beautiful set of retainers off that. And this happens day after day after day after day, and so I think, you know, as a practice, it's a great exercise to sit down with the team and sort of ask them and I'm you know, talking about specifically retainers, but you really can ask about any service in the practice, you know, do we like this, is this profitable? Is it good for the team? Is it good for the patients? What else is out there? Who's doing other things? You know, what's the what's the newest way to starer as patients? What are other businesses that service patients, even if they're not orthanonys are doing and how could we incorporate that or those types of things in our practice? And then, of course the final decision is do we do this ourselves or do we outsource it? And I think these are the tough questions you have to ask and there's no right answer. But I think if you are having that discussion in your practice, you're one step ahead of everybody else, because everybody else is too busy to have these meetings about growth and change and improvement.

Dean Steinman

They are and again, because you get set in your ways and you know, and if you're a mature practice, you're doing this for ten, fifteen, twenty, twenty five, thirty years and things were going great. But things have changed a lot, guys in the last two years, three years. Okay, I can't remember the last time I spoke to practice.

Who's having a banner year this year? All right, plane and simple. There's a lot of peripheral things going on in the world, but it's it's competition, it's the economy, what have you. So you need to stand out and you need to be able to work smarter. Okay, and by you know, having a program like this, it's a no brainer really from my eyes, and you know, in fact you don't do anything is incredible.

And you know I'd love to just sit back and just get get checks. You know, I mean, boy, boy, oh boy, I would know. That's that's my dream. Just you know why even get up today, checks are coming in.

And by working with you, that's that's you know, that is the self fulfilling prophecy there. But you know, let's talk a little bit more about differentiator. So you know, if somebody is looking for for an Adanta, so they're searching busil line near me or you know, in the sort in their town, they'll see people, you know, top rated Authodonte visital line as low as or one thousand dollars off blah blah blah. But as I just mentioned, what's what's the whole package, what's the whole journey? And once they finish treatment again, if they if you don't use it, they're gonna they're gonna move.

So make life easier, let them understand, help them understand the future, because you've been there all right, you know it's gonna to happen and make life their life easier. And BTE offering a full end to end solution nobody else is doing it. It's a no brainer, guys. It's a no brainer because you know, if you don't just don't offer the first thing you see, which is the abusinal line part, but the whole package, all right, and you need to then be able to figure out how to say that and how to position it.

And again that's where you know, a good marketing company comes and helps you with your branding and positioning there. But you know, let's talk a little bit about you know, retention and re engagement because that's super important as well. So walk we through, you know what the typical scenario of re engagement. Somebody that you know had you know, praises five ten years ago, and you know then what happens.

Blair Feldman

Yeah, I mean there's a lot in here to unpack, and I think you know, one of the ways that Retainer Club helps with re engagement is through our software platform, and that's really the heart of every thing we do. We've invested seven figures in creating a software platform that has a partner side for the practice, an e commerce side for the patient that basically they always see the practice name that they're associated with, so it stays top of mind. I mean, one of the things we fight with in orthodonyx is, you know, two, three, four years later, can the patient remember who their orthodonist is? And if there's never been any communication and there's never been any messaging on you know, how's your retainer? Have you replaced your retainer? Here's why it's important to replace your retainer. There's a decent chance that they'll probably forget who their orthdos is.

Some other shiny, you know, new website or practice will pop up in there in their feed and it might be like, oh, have you replaced your retainer? And they'll be like, yeah, yeah, who are you? Like, I can't remember my orthonyist. I'm just gonna go to you instead. And so this idea of re engagement, there's multiple entry points in my mind. There's your current patients, you know, how do you re engage with them over time? How do you share new services that you're offering.

I mean we're frequently you know, introducing new services to our patient. How do you re engage new patients who are moving to your community. How do you re engage if you you know, maybe pick up a new practice or patients from an older practice. How do you engage these people? Who theoretically have all been treated, you know, but they might need your services.

Most do, and I love the idea of a retainer as a way to be kind of a trojan horse for new patients. The question we always tell practices to ask is, you know, when they come in, patient comes in the sense we're looking for a retainer. And of course this is a there's a deeper side to this, you know, does your practice take patients who are looking for retainers. There's this fear that I've I've heard from practice in the past, like I would never touch a patient who was treated by somebody else.

You're just taking on all their problems, and you know, there might be a little. Bit of truth to that. But my experiences with good records and of course a waiver and a conversation with the patient. You know, you know I didn't do your initial treatment.

You know, I can only help you from where you're at today and move you forward. You know, I think you can. You can reduce any kind of risks dramatically. You can't eliminate it, but you can reduce it dramatically.

So, first of all, if you're taking patients for retainers, I think it's a great entry point happy to make you a retainer. Are you looking to hold teeth exactly where they are or do you want to see changes? And I was joke. You've heard me say this before that like many patients will say, well on a retainer to move this tooth, and this is where you can have that conversation. So retainers actually just whole teeth.

Orthodonics moves teeth. They've got some amazing options for you. They're going to be comfortable. You know, they won't take too much time, and we can get you back to where you were or even better than you were through you know, treatment in our practice.

And so you know the idea of engagement. I mean, you know, nobody knows better than you when you talk about marketing how expensive it is to find a new patient, but it's it's a fraction of that to maintain a relationship with a previous or current patient and you know, get a referral from them, you know, offer them services after orthodonyx is complete retreatment. I know our mutual friend, doctor Nick Axisis, was lecturing once and I think I'm giving proper credit to him when I say this, but he was talking about you know the relationship with plastic surgeons that patients have and the difference between plastic surgery and orthononics. And plastic surgery, you pretty much know, every ten years or so or whatever amount of time, based on the procedure, you have to go in for a revision.

They don't call it relapse of a facelift. They call it a need for a revision. And do they do it for free? Of course not. You know, it's whatever their latest fees are, and you just sort of expect that.

But there's this weird belief in orthononyx that if you know, you warri your retainers, but then maybe you stopped and your teeth move, that like, it's not requiring a revision. It is requiring a revision, and the patients should pay for it. Of course they should. You've got your expertise, you've got service, you've got the greatest technology.

So I think, you know, I'm using this topic of re engagement to activate, you know, previous patients. It could be as simple as replacing a retainer on a regular basis and getting revenue from that process. Or it could be bringing them in or family members in because you've been engaging them over time and you know they actually want orthodonic treatment in your practice. I think it's it's an important topic.

It's worth, you know, really looking at how do you re engage your your patients in your practice. How easy is it, how much work does it take? And you know what services are you offering.

Dean Steinman

As it's a no brainer, especially if you're in a busy metropolitan area or in New York, you're in Phoenix, you're in places where people move into. Most probably somebody in their thirties forties had, you know, without the treatment ten fifteen years ago.

They're new to the town. As you mentioned, the probably didn't use their retainders. So think about this as follow that follow me guys. So now you get somebody in who already believes in what the doontics.

I already did it, So that's hard. Parts the heart cell was already done. You get them back in, you do a scan, you obviously to charge for that scan, and then got three options. One, oh, sorry, what your teeth really moved? You have to go back in and start from scream.

Two they moved a bit. Do you want to just kind of move a fix a little bit and keep it as it is? Or you know, right there can be another option, So you can think about the first one I just mentioned. Your teeth really moved a lot. You've ben putting it touched in ten years.

You need a full on case, okay to chain five six seven thousand bucks. You know they moved a bit. You know, we could do a quick six month you know program for you to chain two three thousand bucks, get them in or the teeth about them, they moved a bit, but we could keep them steady where they are. You know, we get you get a retainer program to change every month when you come in.

So these are people that again and you're in your area, believe in it because they already paid for it, but once before the parents did so they understand what it's like. And now you've got three potential options for them. And then the referral part off the that as well. So it's a huge opportunity to stand out and position yourself differently in the market.

And then you know it's there, you know, you know perfectly said it's so much easy to self resisting customer get a new one. So now that you've got this ongoing program for them, it's a it's a no brainer because you know, and you know how much do you know how much did you charge player for a lost retainer? Ten years ago? I haven't been the.

Blair Feldman

Same that that people charge now. I mean it was, you know, three hundred bucks each charge.

Dean Steinman

Exactly at each person over the course of a lifetime loses five to six seven of them minimum. So at five hundred bucks of pops pops, I'm seven, that's you know, four thousand bucks PERCs out of pocket versus somebody every month to spend there, you know, twice a year whatever it is. You know, the program that they sign up for, you don't do a thing. So it's kind of a no brainer.

Guys. This is something once again that you really have to figure out where your practice is.

Blair Feldman

Yeah. One of the things you said, which which made me think, and it's so important, is the power of the three D scan and how we still underutilize it even after all these years for this amazing technology, the three D scans, and you know, I feel like it was it was huge improvements in like comfort and speed, and now it's sort of plateaued out a little bit.

You know, we're two to two plus minute scans. I mean, it doesn't really matter to most patients how much faster. It is than that. But these scans are incredibly useful and powerful in the practice.

I mean, if you bring somebody back. Some of the most interesting practices and successful practices we study are doing these wellness scans. So it's a they They recommend the patient comes in every two to three years for a scan. The great thing about it is in most states, the doctor doesn't have to be around.

This can be done on a non patient day. This can be done by team members, and so they do the scan, the doctor reviews it, maybe they send a video note to the patient. Hey, Dean, you know I saw your new scan. I reviewed it.

Everything looks great, looks like you're doing an amazing job with your retainers. They did notice a little chip in that front tooth. I'm curious, you know, has your dentist taken care of that. If not, I can refer you to a great dentist that can do that for you.

I also noticed you've got a new crown, so I'm wondering if your retainers, you know, fitting as well as it did last time. We can make a new retainer of that scan we did today. By the way, we're we're always accepting new referrals. I know you have you know, two kids who were young when I saw you last time, but they're probably the right age.

Seven is when we look at patients for exams and would love to see you. You know, what a what a modern, great way to communicate with that comfortable three D scan. Those scans are worth, you know, real revenue to the practice. And they're just all right difficult to do.

Dean Steinman

And as a layman, you know, when I go to a practice, I see the scan in action. It's mind blowing, really what you're looking at and how you know it's been the round and you can see exactly what is within seconds, your whole treatment plan is done there and you can see exactly what it's. If you're sitting in that chair and the practice knows how to do it the right way and use the 3D scan, you should be able to close it like that. You know,

Blair Feldman

I remember a story, you know, we we do a lot of in my practices. We used to do a lot of sports mouthguards and then we bring a team in and we'd scan and them and we always got patients from them. And of course that's the other side of our business. Mouthguard Club Custom sports Mouthguards which we think are a great practice growth tool, totally underutilized by our industry.

But basically, my script before I do a scan was, Hey, I'm doctor Felman, I'm an orthanoniest, and I'm going to be doing a scan. This is a three D scan. Anything coming up, you know, any dental treatment or braces that might affect the fit of this mouthguard we're making you. And the patient said, or the athlete who was a football player, said I might be getting braces soon, and the mom goes, no, he's not.

He doesn't need braces. He's not getting braces. Said okay, no problem, I'll do the scan. So I do the scan, and then, of course I always sort of my last before I walk away is or you know, the team member does a scan and I kind of come back.

But the last thing I do personally is i'd go up and I'd say, so, this is your teeth. This is like a giant iPad. You can check it out. You know.

Again, I'm an orthonost. Asking me any questions by your teeth, I'm happy to answer them for you. And the mom said, that's his teeth, and I said, oh, yeah, that was the scan we did right now, and she could tell because how good it is, how easy it is to visualize crowding and spacing and you know, you. Know, all kinds of bite issues on that scan.

She said, Oh my gosh, I need to get him in for an orthodonic console. And of course you know we were there as like, you know, let's let's you. Know, we can do it right now. And so, I mean, I think you know that that communication over a scan, you know, is so easy for patients to understand.

So when you say you have crowding and they're like, I don't really think I have crowding, you know, like it's it's a little bit. But when you see. It this big on your on your thirty or inch monitor or whatever, you know, you you can't argue with it, you know, you really can. You can relate to that, and then of course you can't stop thinking about it once you see it, and you know you're you're really interested in you know, corrections.

Dean Steinman

Yeah. So you know, in a nutshell, retainers are have so many useful uses across the board, from the from a patient's perspective and to your perspective as an orthodontist authentist, you know, it re engages to get patients in It's a way for you open up communication with them. It's a way to get referrals. It's a way to continually your relationship with your patients if you utilize correctly.

There's a lot of money that you could bring it to your practice by just thinking differently outside the box. And as this is twenty twenty four, all right, things have changed drastically since the old days of twenty twenty two. All right, seriously, that's how crazy things happened, you know, in the last two years. You know, in twenty twenty two, there was no chat GPD.

That's that's how long ago things have changed. Was no AI, you know, I mean there was, but it wasn't even close to being out there and using you know, technologies and you doze and things the right way. Is a game changer for your practice. So Claire, in closing, if somebody wants to learn a little bit more about retaining a club, get more information, talk with you about it.

What's the best way for them to reach you.

Blair Feldman

Yeah, First of all, you can reach out to me personally. I am a tech junkie, so you can find me email. You can find on LinkedIn, So my emails Blair at retainer club dot com.

You can go to the retainer club dot com website. I think one of the important things there is to realize that we are a B two B two C company. We work through a network of practices and you can't buy anything as a patient on our site. You have to go to one of our partner practices, so, you know, learning about becoming a partner and offering this service and really making that decision that you know, our best use of our time is focusing on treatment and so the things like retention and retainer programs that you can outsource it easily and really, you know, explode the power of this while you're continuing to grow your practice is to me, the smart way to go about this, So go to retainer club dot com.

We have a section for practices at the bottom. You can find it, and I would love to continue the conversation with you.

Dean Steinman

I definitely reach out to them for many of our practices to Blair and you know, these guys, they're great. I believe it's something as you at least consider if you're working with another company, just pay the phone and call and see what the difference is and make it.

Make the wise choice, you know, and then feel happy with with after getting both sides say we are if not, you know, it's good to get to basically not do anything and get paid for it, you know, you know, and at the same time, I'm really excited you know that you know, have relationship with Blair and Retainer Club and we were able to help practices who want to market themselves and stand out. You know that we do so with with you. So if you are thinking of you know it's been a tough year and you're not just getting the new patients that you want, reach out to us and we can then help facilitate how to stand out and using retainers as part of your process, and you'll see the difference. You'll see the patients come in.

You'll you know, because I've heard so many practices that you know, my last agency didn't work and the ads didn't work, and marketing is no good, but well, marketing iss is necessity. If you don't market yourself, you know, turn the a business sign on today, you have to do that. There, you have to market. So we have to stand out and that's where a company like us could work to work with you and help you position you using retainers as a very very big difference in the market there.

So again, Blaire, thanks so much for joining everybody and podcast, thank you so much for listening, for watching, for getting your feedback from always the great you know, great messages and comments on all the social media and look forward to join you guys, joining us again in the future and once again. And it's like it's the great Jerry Garcia said, nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile, Thanks everybody and be safe.

Blair Feldman

Bye